Decline in Irish society

I think society changed when they stopped corporal punishment in schools etc.

All of a sudden the little feckers were saying "you can't touch me. I know my rights" etc.

Yesterday, in Sydney, a 13yr old boy doused a 9yr old in petrol and set him on fire. He's using the excuse that cos he saw somebody who commited suicide then its ok!!!

What will happen to him - probably feckin nothing. Too many bloody do-gooders who say "it's not their fault.

Most of these judges need to live in normal situations to see how normal people live when they give out sentences - and thats when they bother.

Pogue Mahoney wrote: It is a strange situation allright. Just before I left Dublin in '76 there was an unarmend off-duty Garda shot while chasing a bankrobber through St.Annes.

Young and all as I am Pogue, I remember that well. His name was Garda Michael Reynolds and he happened to be passing the Bank of Ireland in Killester when he noticed the robbery. He gave chase in his own car and then on foot. When he finally caught up with the robbers in the Park they shot him dead.

Regarding the current state of affairs, I have serious issues with the performance of our current Justice Minister, particularly with regards to his priorities but won't go into them here.

Mel, just on your post about the country going down the toilet, I've been thinking the same thing for years, not just crime but Traffic, Health, Planning Corruption etc. My own favourite expression and one I've been using for years is that the Country is " going to the dogs."

As a society we need to have a zero-tolerance attitude to all the misdemenours which culminate in a litany of serious crimes. Just look at the the amount of litter, especially cig ends, on the street. In theory, each one of these is a €125 fine. Wouldn't it be self-financing to employ more litter wardens who would also have the powers to arrest these drunken bums vomiting, and whatever else, in the streets. We have to reclaim our cities and towns.

As I was going home on the train one evening there was a DART stopped at malahide going in the opposite direction. There were two scangers drinking and smoking in the train with feet on the seats. I thought there was supposed to be CCTV cameras "for our protection"

I was colelcting my son from Swords one night because he couldn't get a taxi. The crowd had just spilled out of the pub onto the busy street. because there were so many scuffles broke out and some guy was getting the s**t kicked out of him on the street. I drove up to them and managed to stop it. No police in sight. This seemingly is a regular occurrence in Swords at the week-ends. However, at the pavilions the security guards called the gardai when an African woman lost control and berated her child who had been lost. 2-3 security guards got involved and there was Garda there within 5 minutes.

Rolo wrote: Ah you're just jealous Mel.

 at Rolo!

Right - never saw this thread before, but feel the need to wade in with a bit of balance. so many opinions and so much scope to have a cyber argument - just what I need! I love a good debate.

There are some horror individuals and happenings going on all round this fair city and country. Agreed 100% and don't take anything after as an acceptance or tolerance of this.

BUT,

wouldn't focus on newpapers and their feelings on the level of crime. They know that crime and fear sell papers - a front page headline of "All's well with the world" will sell a lot less than "scum roam our streets". There's a lot of normal happy people who never hit the news.

there were some strange things happening all those years ago Pat back when everyone was obediant. There were big problems with the control exercised by the church (and others - don't want a "bash the bishop" session ). Women (and men) forced to give up their kids because they were bastards, because they were the product of sin, because they were born outside of God's law.

I don't feel any less safe on the streets of Dublin now then I did back in the 80's or before. There were (and are) parts of Dublin that you didn't go into after dark. There were (and are) parts of dublin where you keep your eyes peeled for trouble at all times of day and night. There were (and are) people who look freaky. But, I'm sure some people would find members of this site scary with long hair and leathers and denims and patches and "satanism"....)

American economic culture has certainly given me a lot that my parents didn't. I have money in my arse pocket and the ability to spend it that they didn't. Maybe as my kids grow older and start spending I'll have less, but interest rates are a lot lower than 15%, tax rate is way lower than 65% odd, inflation lower than it used be, and my mates have jobs, most are still in Ireland. Whether you look from macro or micro, we have certain things we usedn't to. I remember the face on my da when he'd see a bill coming through, when he'd be begging the bank manager for some scope. And jumped up little toerags that they were, they enjoyed the power! Not trying to exaggerate poverty levels, but there weren't always luxuries on the table - we were aware from an early age that prioritisation took place.

I am not saying life is perfect, I'm not even saying life is better. But it would be very wrong, imho, to say that life is much worse. It's just different.

Mins, I would be very reluctant to arm the guards until there are serious changes in accountability and cuture within the force (not a criticism of individuals guards as they say one of my mates is now a copper!). But, some of the stuff in Donegal is v worrying for example.

I think the answer is to continue at the macro level with the low tax and incentive culture we have created, but at the local level to empower local government and community groups to do things in the community. Places need tidying up, grass needs cutting, playgrounds need building - these can create a sense of pride in an area. but then, people will whinge about double taxation - the very same socialists who should crave this local power and the chance to DO something. (not wanting to nail my coulours to the mast or anything)

In any generation, there have been people blessed to be brought up with love, care, attention, discipline and great values. I remember my childhood with great affection despite some money worries that we had. And I'm happy in my own skin.

So despite some of the scum wandering our streets, despite the unwillingness of our politicians to do something about some serious fundamental issues in society, I'm a happy bunny.

I like this country, and think it's stil lthe best place to live (and have no intention of going anywhere else to find out if I'm wrong!!!!)

so there!!!! just going to draw breath and get back to work.....